The Duco finishes were also done on some Triolians. Although most had the "Walnut Sunburst" and Polychrome paintjobs.

The most obvious difference between the Duolian and Triolian is that the Duolian came with an "ebonized" maple fretboard (read: stained black) and the Triolian came with a natural maple fretboard. Both had a 10" radius, which seems to run counter to what other posters are claiming here regarding differences in neck sizes. (Equivilent years should be identical).

Note: After 34 both came with Basswood necks that were stained to look like mahogany.

Other than that, the equivilent year bodies and cones are identical. The only differences at the body are the paint jobs. Duolian's came with solid, frosted, and in later years piano finishes. The Triolians generally came with more flashy paint jobs that included things like hula girls on the back.

Bakelite necks were "tried" on both models in 29 & 30. But people generally shy away from the bakelite models because they tend to deteriorate over time making them crack and warp. And since they're not wood, there's no way to fix them once this happens.

I must agree that purchasing a bakelite neck Triolian without personal inspection is an extreme risk. I recently purchased one myself but for less than half of that and expected to replace the neck. The one that I bought ahd a cracked headstock, but what could not be predetermined was that there was 3/16 relief in the neck and there are 2 screws that attach the wood neck stick to the bakelite neck that are prone to starting a crack that seperates the neck at the heel to body joint. There is also s large cutout under the fingerboard that is not cut out on wood necked guitars.

I'm a registered user.
But I've only recently joined up.

Searching old threads is fun and I can find things that interest me and add in my own replies.
.
I don't see what the problem is in "dredging" up old threads - no one has to reply to them if they don't want to !

Come on !
(as opposed to "common")

Peace, man !

Anyway, I've got an old Duolian/Triolian body without original paint on it so not sure if a Triolian or a Duolian.

Its exactly the same shape as my mate's bakelite-necked 1929 Triolian. Body depth at neck end looks 1/4" narrower at neck end than later models (& Nat Resophonics).

Snake..if the fretboard has binding it's probably a Triolian.

About Registration? - "Registration is recommended, but not required, in order to post messages in this forum. Unless registered, you will not be able to edit messages after they are submitted."

I didn't realize that views and opinions of non-registered users were so distasteful to those that have taken the time to register. But according to the board bylaws directly quoted above, it's not a requirement. Sorry for crashing the party, but...

With regard to whether or not I'm the fish that bought a bakelite necked national over on eBay. I'm definitely not.

I own a chocolate brown frosted deco finish 1934 Duolian (finish 95% intact) with a basswood neck and a real ebony fingerboard that was replaced before I got it because of severe gouging in the original. It knocked a good chunk off the price and by the opinions of all players including myself it actually improves the tone over the original maple fretboard. (The Style O's and Tricones came with ebony fretboards from the factory). Maybe someday I'll put it back to original, but for now, it's a nice player.

Anyway...

As far as dissing Bakelite necks. I was just stating the facts. They are prone to cracking, chipping, and warping and have no structurally sound ways of being repaired.

Think of it this way, do you really want a guitar neck that's made out of the same material as they used for telephones in the 40's and 50's? National certainly didn't think too highly of them when they started coming back to the factory with problems that they couldn't repair. That's largely why they had such a short run and were discontinued after only about 18 months of sales. Bakelite breaks down and becomes increasingly brittle over time, this is a limitation of the material that wasn't immediately recognized in it's early usages.

With respect to their lower value from a collectible perspective, this is also fact. Just pull out your Gruhn blue book. Unfortunately, the cost of vintage instruments has sky rocketed so much that instruments that were always considered inferior like bakelite nationals or 3 bolt 70's strats have now been given a new lease on life by vintage dealers that describe these as "great" instruments now worth as much as their superior construction counterparts. Unfortunately, in the name of making a buck, these types of less than honest sellers are taking advantage of buyers that may not be aware of the facts.

ah! the advantage of registering, you can go back and edit the bad spelling!!!

Mr. Deltablue, I have no problem with non registered posters. I was merely pointing out that whoever you are, you prefer to remain anonymous. You could just as likely be a member. You are surely well versed in the workings of this forum. Question 1. Are you a member?

I did not say that you were the bloke that won the Triolian. As I'm sure you know, I said you were deltblues, an individual who has made 78 ebay purchases and who cagily adds a few cents to his bids (clever), and who placed a bid with seconds remaining but lost. Question 2. Are you deltblue?

There was a thread, last posted to about a week ago, regarding the differences between Duolians and Triolians. I wonder why you didn't post to that thread. Albeit it is about bodies, but still, if one does a search for Bakelite necks, only one thread comes up, the one you revived from two years ago. I think that's what you wanted to talk about. That stuff about 10" radiused fingerboards was a ruse. In fact, if you're as clever as I think you think you are, that was a brilliant stroke. There was bound to be some response to that obvious blunder, keeping the thread at the top of the list. You are obviously an expert. Question 3. Why did you make that erroneous statement?

If someone was interested in purchasing a Bakelite necked Triolian,(perhaps with the knowledge provided by Jomo, whom I apologize to) I think you would have to agree after looking at the pictures, this example would be one worth taking a gamble on. Someone who has an awareness of this forum might suspect that there may be competition from this quarter. And said competition would probably be at their computer as the time ran down. And, to kill time, they would probably visit this forum. Why not throw a little doubt into their mind?

Well, I apologise if all these things are coincidence. I have been keeping an eye on ebay recently, more as a learning experience than anything. And, I couldn't help but notice these discrepencies in your statements in this thread. I point this out to the other members who may be involved in an ebay auction and are suprised to see a tangential discussion arise at just the right time. Deltablue, If I am wrong, why don't you become a member so that we can get to know and trust your opinions. Until then I for one, will question your motives.

All for now.
John C.

[This message has been edited by Sherlock Holmes(edited March 12, 2003).]

Mike D, I said I had a triolian/duolian BODY
ie. without original neck.
It has been repainted years ago and does have a neck on it - by Don Young in 1986 - a 12 string neck !

I'm not into 12 string so I'm planning on having the neck replaced for a baritone neck.

The body has exactly the same dimensions as my pal's bakelite-necked Triolian, so I wonder if it could also be a triolian - perhaps it originally had a bakelite neck ?

Ooooooh - I just thought !!
When I get the neck removed, if it has that "thumb-hole" in the top - it might just be a Triolian body !

Doh! You are correct sir, I missed that.

Ooooooh - I just thought !!
When I get the neck removed, if it has that "thumb-hole" in the top - it might just be a Triolian body !

I recently purchased sn#A957 for $850 pictured in my previous post. It will be renecked with a maple neck like my 31 has.

Call me suspicious but there appears to be a screw between the 11th and 12th frets where the dot is missing that does not belong there. This could be a temporary repair. The bakelite necks have a block of bakelite that hangs down into the cut out in the top of the body and there is a wooden neck stick bolted to the bakelite neck with 2 bolts one of which is directly under the 13th fret and are prone to cracks there.
The screw is missing at the end of the fretboard where the dot is missing. This screw was screwed through a 1/2x1/2x6" piece of maple underneath the metal body to hold the body flat against the fretboard.

Also in the side views of the neck the strings ae quite high and the neck looks like it may be bowed around the 7th fret.

Big Mike Simpson
aka Antlerslide
http://members.cox.net/blueswizards

Waxwing, I'm not deltablue or any other derivative thereof. I'm "Deltablues" here, on ebay, on every other message board and on all my websites:
- www.deltabluesman.com
- www.schematicheaven.com
- www.the-crossroads.org

A vintage National body for only $850? By adding a period correct neck you'll have an excellent player at and excellent price.