I wish to ask a question to you guitar experts. Thee is always SOMEONE out there that knows the answer! What a forum this is...

I just bought this cutie on eBay... http://www.deivert.com/parlor/
my first ever instrument bought there, and the first I ever bought without trying it first. Nervous? YES! It isn't delivered but the man that sold it sounds very nice via email. Must have trust.

well, any of you familiar with these things? Is there any way of dating exactly? What do these sound like? I play fingerpicking blues and a lot of resonator guitar. Want that old time ladder braced bluesy sound for fingerpicking in a small guitar. A freind of mine has a Fraulini, and it is brilliant.

any replies appreciated...

cheers
BERT

thanks!

cheers
BERT

His father played this guitar alot, lots of wear in the picking area and even significant wear on the end of the soft wood headstock which is where I figured out that he leaned it against the wall. He played jazz guitar very well (musical family) and liked this guitar as a favorite even though he also had a very nice Martin. Yours looks like it has been very nicely restored so it is surely going to sound much better than my neighbor's guitar with the old strings. After posting some photos here at the IGS BBS I got alot of information on it including that this is apparently the same model of guitar that Charley Patton is holding in a famous photo. I'll see if I can find that topic in a minute.

I also saw one just last week at the 'Trading Musician' in Seattle, Washington, USA: Here is the URL with a photo. The tag on the guitar actually says Stromberg-Voisenet/Kay 1930s. I have not been aware that there is any way to date these guitars precisely:

http://www.tradingmusician.com/catalog/index.cfm?fuseaction=product&theParentId=306&id=6173#

That was confusing to me and I eventually assumed that this Bruno guitar was made by V-S/ Kay.

I just now found the topic I mentioned about the V_S Kay guitar (I had the name wrong for one- I had assumed it was a Bruno). Lots of interesting posts there, I am glad I found it again. (I was pretty mentally ragged back then and am working on it again tonight)

Here is the thread:

http://www.guitarseminars.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/010873.html

Bruno was a distributor, they didn't manufacture. I've had guitars marked "The Vernon" with Bruno labels from both Stromberg-Voisenet and from Lyon and Healy.

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Originally posted by DiegoMoon:
That first example has the little mustache bridge that I've generally seen on these guitars. I've seen these with mahogany backs and sides and with (what I assume is Brazilian) rosewood backs and sides. As far as dating goes I don't think they did any date coding on these, I could be wrong. I know they didn't serialize them.

Bruno was a distributor, they didn't manufacture. I've had guitars marked "The Vernon" with Bruno labels from both Stromberg-Voisenet and from Lyon and Healy.

[This message has been edited by DiegoMoon (edited 04-04-2006).]

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Thanks, DiegoMoon. That led me to look at the photos of my neighbor's guitar again to look at the wood. I remember enhancing the photos, lightening them on the front side of the guitar to highlight the decals- so it is a bit darker than shown in the photo (front). Originally I thought the artwork was silkscreened but after discussing it he explained that decals were much less expensive to use in mass production and he has experience with similar decals on old pianos. I'll link two photos here. The wood is dark on the back and you can see the wear on the top. I think my neighbor said his dad also played flamenco. If he liked this guitar so much it must have played well.
I might go down and play it again. He and his wife want some lessons, and that would be fun. He is a French Horn player.

As for the original post and questions about how it sounds, I really don't have an answer for that because I didn't play it enough to know, I was very busy talking. I see now that it has nylon strings put on it instead of the steel ones which his father used. My neighbor put those on to reduce string tension. That is probably why I wasn't impressed with it. I'll have to go down and play it more, maybe they will put some nice steel strings on it.

This one is not carved on the back of the headstock. Just for purposes of comparisons here are some pics:

The following picture shows some deep grooves worn into the fingerboard behind the frets, some appear light because of reflection and others, like above the 2nd fret, appear dark. They go all the way to the C fret on the first two strings and every fretted note below the 5th fret This has been played alot. I imagine that it has been refretted a few times:

This photo shows the bridge piece which has a very thin slot for the fretwire which is used for the saddle on the bridge. I was looking at it close and thinking that is a good way to do it. We still assume that this is the original bridge, and there is no evidence or known history that it had been changed from the square ended style of bridge.

Finally, I am quite impressed with the fact that the neck is still straight and the intonation is almost perfect after about 80 years and alot of playing. It was well worth the original $5.00. Incidently, my friend's father bought this at a Pawn Shop in Snohomish Washington, in about 1927-1930. I only assumed that he had bought it new in that pawn shop, but it is just as likely that he bought it used, or near new.

...I don't know what you'd call the bridges on the Stromberg guitars, but I wouldn't use the term "mustache bridge" to describe 'em.

They seem to have come in two varieties, as shown below:

the "flat" version

the "pyramid" version (my 20's B&J Serenader has a bridge like this)

Maybe they were inspired by Washburn bridges such as this one?

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Originally posted by DiegoMoon:
Your top example is either German or French,

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Originally posted by DiegoMoon:
I'm sure there were small companies that were building components for all of the Chicago builders.

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My B&J Serenader appears to have the same body shape as the Strombergs...any clue as to who could have made this? My first guess was Harmony, but now I have my doubts.

I have a mid-30s Supertone round hole archtop identical to the one in this ad:

For what it's worth, this is a great article on Sears and Harmony in the early years.

Harmony Parlor Guitars

I can't get these to come up as images so I'll make them links.

Picture 1
Picture 2
Picture 3

Peter

That guitar is beautiful by the way.

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Originally posted by pto:
Just out of interest, here is a pic of the stencil on my guitar. I presume it's a Stromberg-Voisinet but it has a regular slotted headstock and the bridge looks very modern, maybe replaced, I can't tell.

Peter

[This message has been edited by pto (edited 04-04-2006).]

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(I didn't repost the photo with the quote)
Hey Peter, what do you mean 'regular slotted headstock'? It is not like the ones shown? The slots go all the way through? Is the shape the same with a 'v' neck, etc.? Someone referred to those shown as 'half-slotted' and there must be a more appropriate term for this slotted headstock. I should remember that from machinist school but I don't ('broached' or something like that). Your guitar is a beauty, just like the one I posted but in such remarkably better condition. It will probably last a long time.

Yes, headstock is cut all the way through and it does have a "V" neck. Pics below.

Peter

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Originally posted by bighollowtwang:

I have a mid-30s Supertone round hole archtop identical to the one in this ad:

Quite an amazing guitar. I also assumed it was Harmony-made, but I've seen Regal-made Washburn and Kay guitars with an identical body...[/B]

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I also have a Supertone identical to the one in the ad. It was given to me by my wife's grandmother who had it since the thirties.

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Originally posted by bighollowtwang:

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I have one of those Supertones. Those are some really strange fret markers.

They are very lightly built (for archtops) so in the worst case, they will have a "sunken" top, but if you find a decent one they sound great, warmer than you would expect from an archtop. They have the dreaded "bar frets" too. Weird "A" bracing inside.
I've also seen very similar guitars with slotted headstocks and mahogany back & sides (the Supertones are all birch) sold under the "Harmony" brand name, as well as Regals that look virtually identical. I don't think round hole archtops are very popular nowadays. They sound great for that dry Mance Lipscomb/Lil' Son Jackson/Lightnin Hopkins style (yeah I know they played regular flattops, Harmony Sovereigns, etc).

Here's mine, along with a Columbia, a 20s B&J Serenader (Stromberg Voisenet), Lyon & Healy Jupiter, and a terrifying 60s Stella 12 which I keep tuned down to A (!!) with everything in octaves except the highest string pair.

Great bottom end growl especially in dropped D which I use a lot, and I have gotten into Bo Carter and Sam chatmon things since getting it. The songs just suited the guitar!

cheers
BERT